"I cannot have public confusion between scientific advice and policy" - Page 2

JennyPiccolo · 6th November 2009, 10:14am

wonder what Ed Balls is saying about it.

pANDAS Radio · 6th November 2009, 10:17am

They certainly pricked his bubble.

Eulonima · 6th November 2009, 11:53am

i have nothing to add exceptMON THE PROF NUTT.

Jaemi · 6th November 2009, 12:06pm

There are wider social issues, like it or not, that are currenty associated with canabis and swedge.
Proffessor Nutt knows this and his resignation is nothing more than politically motivated.

endless psych · 6th November 2009, 12:21pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaemi

There are wider social issues, like it or not, that are currenty associated with canabis and swedge.
Proffessor Nutt knows this and his resignation is nothing more than politically motivated.

That's not the issue, the issue is that an attempt was made to gag a scientific adviser and stop them commenting on scientific evidence that ran against gubmint policy.

Sack him for not taking account of the issues, fair enough, but sack him for disagreeing with you? Just plain wrong.

The wider issues associaed with illegal drugs are, in my opinion, caused by the nature of their illegallity not the drugs. In terms of the social problems associated with cannabis - do they cause more or less problems then other drugs at higher or lower classifications? Or even legal ones?

corky · 6th November 2009, 2:40pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaemi

There are wider social issues, like it or not, that are currenty associated with canabis and swedge.
Proffessor Nutt knows this and his resignation is nothing more than politically motivated.

Look at Portugal, they legalised posession of all controlled substances and addiction rates and drug death rates have both gone down.

Jaemi · 6th November 2009, 3:25pm

I'm saying that it's not just a case of "Government ignore scientists".
Nutt was on C4 news telling everyone that horse riding is more dangerous than canabis.
I imagine he's employed to advise the government on the health issues relating to drugs, then it's the governments job to come up with policy which takes that into account, along with several other issues.

Both parties are at fault.

*LesMTS* · 6th November 2009, 3:31pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaemi

I'm saying that it's not just a case of "Government ignore scientists".
Nutt was on C4 news telling everyone that horse riding is more dangerous than canabis.
I imagine he's employed to advise the government on the health issues relating to drugs, then it's the governments job to come up with policy which takes that into account, along with several other issues.

Both parties are at fault.

The horse riding thing was nothing to do with this issue. What happened here was that Nutt was giving an academic lecture at a University, in his role as a scientist, not in his role as a government adviser, where he said cannabis and ecstasy were less dangerous than alcohol and tobacco.

Jaemi · 6th November 2009, 3:38pm

Not deliberately, no.
I initially thought that his opinions were given as a government advisor.

Mwezzi · 6th November 2009, 5:19pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by corky

Look at Portugal, they legalised posession of all controlled substances and addiction rates and drug death rates have both gone down.

Look at us, we have easily-available booze everywhere and our alcoholism rates are sky-high.

Not disagreeing with you on the 'Governmental demonisation of substances is shit' point, just that such an argument is a tad simplistic because our social attitudes towards various substances are such that we may experience very different results, at least initially, to our Portuguese counterparts.

endless psych · 6th November 2009, 6:21pm

Yeah those shifty Portugese with their different society and culture and such...

Ahem...

Quote:

The Portuguese have been labelled the world's biggest drinkers, following a survey carried out by French researchers.

Each and every adult in the country consumes a staggering 11.3 litres of pure alcohol a year, according to the Paris-based National Association for the Prevention of Alcoholism (ANPA).

Portugal and Scotland are alike in health outcomes and occupy similar places at the bottom of international health league tables for heart disease, cancer and the like.

So perhaps cultural differences aren't as salient an objection as they might appear.

Mwezzi · 6th November 2009, 6:40pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by endless psych

Yeah those shifty Portugese with their different society and culture and such...

Ahem...

Portugal and Scotland are alike in health outcomes and occupy similar places at the bottom of international health league tables for heart disease, cancer and the like.

So perhaps cultural differences aren't as salient an objection as they might appear.

Ok, but my point still stands. Very often a change that works exceedingly well in one country needs a certain amount of modification before it can be as effective in another.

endless psych · 6th November 2009, 6:47pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mwezzi

Ok, but my point still stands. Very often a change that works exceedingly well in one country needs a certain amount of modification before it can be as effective in another.

If that's based upon the notion that cultures are somehow incompatable in some way I'd question that greatly.

What examples of a change that works in one country needing modification in another can you give?

ETA: Are there more examples of things not working across cultures then there are working?
Are the modifications small tweaks or large changes to basic concepts?