Scottish Independence - Page 4

Fenntastic · 21st July 2006, 2:46pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyMonolith

Sure, its your preference, it doesn't change the fact that Scotland is a country in Britain, Britain is a country in the european union etc etc.

shoosh. in my head i am scottish and only scotttish. that is the end of my argument. full stop. period. etc etc

**LesMTS** · 21st July 2006, 2:47pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by NuroFenn

shoosh. in my head i am scottish and only scotttish. that is the end of my argument. full stop. period. etc etc

If you're Scottish and only Scottish then why use Americanisms like 'period'?

TheCastrator · 21st July 2006, 2:48pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by NuroFenn

shoosh. in my head i am scottish and only scotttish. that is the end of my argument. full stop. period. etc etc

By saying you're Scottish, you're saying you're also British.

MarkMono · 21st July 2006, 2:48pm

You're just trying to get out of admitting that you don't have any reason you can explain for wanting to solely be referred to as Scottish. Just say that instead of continually pretending to run away to do dishes when we all know you're still reading the thread.

Or, alternatively, go do the dishes.

Stew · 21st July 2006, 2:48pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by darth_haggis

Its got fuck all to do with being blinkered by anyone.

So would you all be against independence?

I really dont understand it, to be honest. I think your reasons (which we havent heard to be honest) wont be much.

As a country of 5 million people Scotland would not be as strong as it is currently as part of the United Kingdom (60 million people). This would result in a weaker economy, military and political system. Another thing would be internationally Scotland wouldn't have a permanent seat on the UN Security Council and would lose the influence currently held over international relations.

Basically, there is no need for independence in this day and age when countries in Europe are coming together more and more. ie Single currency, moving between countries has never been easier etc.

darth_haggis · 21st July 2006, 2:49pm

Scotland is a country that you were (if indeed so) born in.
You cant change the country you were born in.

Britain is a sovereign state you are born into.
This could be changed.

The first, as much as you might not like the country, you can do little about.

The second, can change.

MarkMono · 21st July 2006, 2:52pm

I was born in Holland, I would dispute that logic.

Though mindless patriotism doesn't make me feel very proud to be Scottish, or indeed any nationality.

**LesMTS** · 21st July 2006, 2:52pm

Britain is a bunch of Islands which Scotland happens to be a part of. If we were all independent and hated eachother we'd still all be British.

darth_haggis · 21st July 2006, 2:57pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stew

As a country of 5 million people Scotland would not be as strong as it is currently as part of the United Kingdom (60 million people). This would result in a weaker economy, military and political system. Another thing would be internationally Scotland wouldn't have a permanent seat on the UN Security Council and would lose the influence currently held over international relations.

Basically, there is no need for independence in this day and age when countries in Europe are coming together more and more. ie Single currency, moving between countries has never been easier etc.

There is no 'need'? So is there a need for Scotland to be part of Britain?
The rest, isnt factual - its only a possibility.
Scotland has plenty of resource at its disposal.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyMonolith

Oh come on, why not?

You can, but I dont think its a good one

Anyway, since when did Britain become a country

Quote:

Originally Posted by LesMTS

If you're Scottish and only Scottish then why use Americanisms like 'period'?

Thats as daft as the "its stupid" argument.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheCastrator

By saying you're Scottish, you're saying you're also British.

Are you? No, by saying you are British, you are possibly one of four nations.
By saying you are Scottish, you are in fact, Scottish. Anyone interested in Geography may say "thats part of Britain, isnt it?".
I doubt someone would ever say that, though (within reason)

Quote:

Originally Posted by LesMTS

Britain is a bunch of Islands which Scotland happens to be a part of. If we were all independent and hated each other we'd still all be British.

How is that so

MarkMono · 21st July 2006, 2:59pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by darth_haggis

You can, but I dont think its a good one

Oh come on, why not?

Quote:

Originally Posted by darth_haggis

Anyway, since when did Britain become a country

As I previously stated, I see it as an island with an imaginary line down the middle.

**LesMTS** · 21st July 2006, 2:59pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by darth_haggis

How is that so

In a similar way to how Israel and Lebanon are both Middle Eastern.

TheCastrator · 21st July 2006, 2:59pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by darth_haggis

By saying you are Scottish, you are in fact, Scottish. Anyone interested in Geography may say "thats part of Britain, isnt it?".

"Why yes, yes it is."
"So you're British, then?"
"Yes. Evidently."

Stew · 21st July 2006, 3:01pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by darth_haggis

There is no 'need'? So is there a need for Scotland to be part of Britain?
The rest, isnt factual - its only a possibility.
Scotland has plenty of resource at its disposal.

So everyone keeps saying in the lovely little adverts which Sean Connory sometimes flies over from his home abroad to support and voice over. (Loves the country that much he lives abroad to avoid taxes..!)

Of course there is a need for Scotland to be part of the UK.

Where is a country of 5 million people going to get the money for a separate military, national health system, education, infrastructure and everything else which goes with breaking off from the UK?

I certainly don't fancy paying a fucktonne more taxes than I already do -- if Scotland was to gain independence then I can see the richest people in the country leaving to avoid the increase in taxes which would inevitable follow and it'd result in the middle and lower taxes paying more and more. Something they'd probably not be able to do considering the average per capita is around about £5k lower than that of the UK as a whole.

It's all very nice to speculate and want to be a separate country until taxes go up, the rich flee and we lose our voice in the international community.

*Potatojunkie* · 21st July 2006, 3:04pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stew

Where is a country of 5 million people going to get the money for a separate military, national health system, education, infrastructure and everything else which goes with breaking off from the UK?

You'd be surprised by the number of countries with populations of 5 million or fewer which aren't part of the UK, you really would.

England wants an expensive and wholly worthless nuclear submarine programme? Fine. Let them have it in England and let's stop chipping in for it.

England wants to support America's expansionist military adventures in the Middle East? Good luck to 'em.

England's education system's in a shitty mess as it is. You know you're actually discouraged from taking both English and Maths, rather than having both be compulsory?

Stew · 21st July 2006, 3:07pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Potatojunkie

You'd be surprised by the number of countries with populations of 5 million or fewer which aren't part of the UK, you really would.

Yeah, but their economies have been able to cope as they haven't woken up one day and thought, "Oh, I know.. let's break off from a secure economy and see how we fare on our own."

Sure, after maybe 15-20 years it would balance out and Scotland might have a strong enough economy to survive, but by that time the oil reserves will be even more depleted, the fish stocks will be non-existent and it'll be a country of lower-middle classed people who've been taxed up to the eyeballs.

ALSO, name me a country with 5 million people or thereabouts with a better economy, military and standard of living in general than that of the UK. That's what Scotland would be giving up.

But you knew that, 'cos you're just playing with me, aren't you.