Revealed: rise of creationism in UK schools - Page 4

**LesMTS** · 28th November 2006, 11:21am

Quote:

Originally Posted by StuntGirl

Oh, I just realised why Christians wouldn't like that theory...god being fallible, fucking up his creations continuously and human being being nothing more than a rough cut of the real deal (which might take another half dozen catastrophes to rectify).

But he did fuck us up anyway didn't he? Hence the fall of man, original sin etc. Surely a perfect creation wouldn't be so irresponsible....or stupid, I mean, here you are in paradise with all you could ever want or need but you can't resist a particularly tasty looking apple because a talking snake, a snake, tells you it's dead nice. If I was Eve I'd have put the snake down to the mushrooms Adam and I had for breakfast and probably go try to sleep it off.

StuntGirl · 28th November 2006, 11:41am

Quote:

Originally Posted by LesMTS

But he did fuck us up anyway didn't he? Hence the fall of man, original sin etc. Surely a perfect creation wouldn't be so irresponsible....or stupid, I mean, here you are in paradise with all you could ever want or need but you can't resist a particularly tasty looking apple because a talking snake, a snake, tells you it's dead nice. If I was Eve I'd have put the snake down to the mushrooms Adam and I had for breakfast and probably go try to sleep it off.

Ah, but you see, Eve wouldn't have known that it was freaky to have a snake talk to you until after eating the fruit from the tree of knowledge. And god put the tree of knowledge in the garden to test Adam and Eve, and to test out this new fangled contraption called free will. the argument is that its the human thirst for knowledge that fucked us all up, and God only thought he was being nice by giving us free will (to differentiate man from animal) to choose what to do with that soon-to-be ill gotten knowledge. Christians (well, some of them) will argue that creation was and still is perfect, because all you have to do know is ask for God's forgiveness and you'll be atoned and get into heaven.

I cant believe i spent four years of my life teaching people this

Luckily, all of my sunday school students flunked out, and most of them are mopey wee goths now.

MarkMono · 28th November 2006, 11:46am

I dated four different Sunday school teachers before I married one. Blind faith must really push my buttons.

Oh aye, god can't be fallible: He's either 'moving in mysterious ways' or 'its all part of the divine plan'

Pick and paste your favourite rationalisation.

StuntGirl · 28th November 2006, 11:51am

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkMono

Oh aye, god can't be fallible: He's either 'moving in mysterious ways' or 'its all part of the divine plan'

Pick and paste your favourite rationalisation.

'He's moving in mysterious ways' was always my favourite for the students that displayed a greater knowledge of the Bible than me (which wasn't particularly hard), before moving onto Storytime from the Children's Bible and a stauch refusal to answer any questions the the remainder of the lesson.

"Good times"

nevali · 28th November 2006, 12:09pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkMono

I dated four different Sunday school teachers before I married one. Blind faith must really push my buttons.

Oh aye, god can't be fallible: He's either 'moving in mysterious ways' or 'its all part of the divine plan'

Pick and paste your favourite rationalisation.

‘God is merely testing us’ tends to be favourite amongst the most devout and/or radical, I find.

MarkMono · 28th November 2006, 1:05pm

I've never actually had the pleasure of conversing on the subject with people that devout who aren't just in it for the bigotry and/or violence.

Where do you find these people?

**LesMTS** · 28th November 2006, 1:06pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkMono

I've never actually had the pleasure of conversing on the subject with people that devout who aren't just in it for the bigotry and/or violence.

Where do you find these people?

My aunt.

MarkMono · 28th November 2006, 1:09pm

Creepily enough, my auntie Moira was the only person I could think of who actually thought that proven scientific fact was gods way of testing us, and was a nice enough person to actually be able to discuss it with non-believers (i.e. me) without taking any questioning as an attack on her faith.

Must be an aunt thing.

**LesMTS** · 28th November 2006, 1:18pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkMono

Creepily enough, my auntie Moira was the only person I could think of who actually thought that proven scientific fact was gods way of testing us, and was a nice enough person to actually be able to discuss it with non-believers (i.e. me) without taking any questioning as an attack on her faith.

Must be an aunt thing.

My aunt nervously ushered her kids (we're talking a 10, 13 and 15 year old here) away from the dinner table a couple of Christmases ago when I was talking about evolution etc.
She made them sit in a room out of earshot, like if I'd been talking about murdering and raping children or something.

hotblonde · 28th November 2006, 1:22pm

You talk about evolution in a social context? Les! You shouldn't be clutterin up a religious festival with science anyway..

**LesMTS** · 28th November 2006, 1:29pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by hotblonde

You talk about evolution in a social context? Les! You shouldn't be clutterin up a religious festival with science anyway..

It came up in conversation. Sorry.

MarkMono · 28th November 2006, 1:33pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by LesMTS

My aunt nervously ushered her kids (we're talking a 10, 13 and 15 year old here) away from the dinner table a couple of Christmases ago when I was talking about evolution etc.
She made them sit in a room out of earshot, like if I'd been talking about murdering and raping children or something.

Does that really qualify as somebody willing to converse on the subject?

**LesMTS** · 28th November 2006, 1:36pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkMono

Does that really qualify as somebody willing to converse on the subject?

She, being strong of faith, was willing to talk about it. She didn't want her kids minds polluted with my heresy though.

MarkMono · 28th November 2006, 1:41pm

Thats what I meant, christians generally take it as a personal attack on their belief structure. I find such encounters generally unproductive, if I want the 'by the book' version I can just read a bible.

Few and far between have been the faithful who are genuinely willing to be honest about how they relate to their beliefs with someone who harbours different beliefs or, in my case, harbours none at all.

Krocktopus · 28th November 2006, 3:47pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by StuntGirl

Actually, the Creationist's argument is that stuff like dinosaurs, and the world 'appearing' to be billions of years old, etc are all tests set by god to weed out the doubters from the truly pious. Apparently refuting the blindingly obvious is what makes a devout Christian.

I think Intelligent Design is probably the more worrying trend of the two though, as its 'nicer', more comforting and if you're that way inclined, much more believable. It makes people feel special without sounding like the wacked out loons creationists are portrayed as.

what i was meaning was that if you tell 'the kids' about Dinosaurs then they will naturally enough be interested in these giant terrible lizards and humans, being natuarlly inquisitive, will seek to learn more, thus will be able to see the glaring holes in the creationists argument.

After you have introduced the dinosaur argument/fact everything else will fall into place.

Does anyone else think like, for fucks sake, its the fucking 21st century people, evolve!!