"Homeopathy doesn't work"

[beshemoth]

Hee. I heard the theories that the water "remembers" the shape of the molecules that have been in it previously (so therefore all that nonsense I have been reading about temperature in the universe and how it is caused by atoms moving about is... er...)
Also, as someone pointed out, what if the water had previously been contaminated with toxins and "remembered" them as well? Wouldn't people be poisoned every day?

Oh speaking of which...skeptics commit suicide by poison Its an oldie but a goodie (imo)

Edit: oops googled that link and it ain't the one I thought it was, it's a bit more savage than I thought about homeopathy, sorry!

[nevali]

Originally Posted by beshemoth

Wouldn't people be poisoned every day?

Well, quite. Presumably the argument is that all the stuff, er, cancels each other out... or something

[Disco_Stew]

I tried homeopathic therapy methods a couple of times when I was really down a few years back, I was given some powder to take in water and some drops, they just didnt work for me.

[The Continental]

Damn right it doesn't. I mean, what you get up to behind closed doors is your own business but I don't want my kids exposed to it. Bloody homeos.

[nevali]

Originally Posted by The Continental

Damn right it doesn't. I mean, what you get up to behind closed doors is your own business but I don't want my kids exposed to it. Bloody homeos.

I wish people would stop making me proper fucking LOL in the office

[*the transfer*]

http://www.digibio.com/cgi-bin/node.pl?nd=n1

This chap, Dr. Jacques Benveniste, is one of the main scientists behind the whole 'water memory' theory that homeopathy could be explained by. Quite interesting, and his results have been replicated.

I personally think it's mainly placebo effect - i have relatives that swear by homeopathy and have used it all their lives for anything and everything, and so long as they're happy and not ill there surely isn't really an issue. I don't think doctors need to go around telling folk off for using homeopathy if they truly believe it has no effect.

Obviously *herbal* remedies are a different kettle of fish entirely.

Oh and I think the placebo effect is utterly fascinating. Causes terrible problems in the testing of drugs for loads of conditions tho - i mean in depression for example, just the act of going to see a doctor and having someone take an interest on a regular basis can cause a remission of symptoms, comlpetely confounding a trial. Everyone reacts in their own way to treatments, the sooner the general public realise this, the happier I'll be.

[Disco_Stew]

herbal remedies actually help

[Ghostsuit]

Originally Posted by Potatojunkie

I was talking about herbal remedies, here. Specifically the comment "You can't tell me they tested ever herbal remout there?"

If you're going to go taking untested herbal remedies, then you are eating medicine at random. Actual medicines have labels on that tell you what side effects to expect, what other things you shouldn't mix with that medicine, what dosage you should be taking, and so forth.

I blame Resident Evil for all of this.

Ahh miscommunication I was meaning they couldn't have run the test using ever herbal remedies to find out if they are all crap. That make it clearer?

However having read this it turns out homeopathic stuff isn't even herbal remedies so I was off the ball anyway but you might get what I meant.

[TheCastrator]

Originally Posted by beshemoth

Hee. I heard the theories that the water "remembers" the shape of the molecules that have been in it previously (so therefore all that nonsense I have been reading about temperature in the universe and how it is caused by atoms moving about is... er...)
Also, as someone pointed out, what if the water had previously been contaminated with toxins and "remembered" them as well? Wouldn't people be poisoned every day?

Yes, as Jamie Whyte points out in Bad Thoughts, almost every molecule of water, including the stuff you get out of your taps has had a hell of a lot of stuff in it. Tsk.

In fact, I think I'll write a wee bit about what he said on all of it:

The dilution of homeopathic medicines is so great that the resulting liquid is simply water, with not a trace of the originally added substance.
Homeopathologists aknowledge this fact but insist that the prior addition of the active agent and process of dilution give it curative powers lacked by water without the history. They thereby contradict a principle that i have never heard anyone seriously call into question, and which I am sure that even a homeopath would not directly deny: namely that objects with the same properties have the same causal powers, regardless of how they came to have those properties. For example, if Jack and Jill both weight 70 kilograms, then by standing on properly functioning scales each will cause it to register '70 kgs'. It makes no difference if Jack has recently gained weight and Jill lost weight.
[...]

If you believe that homeopathic medicines have effects lacked by water, then you put yourself in an unenviable position. You must either deny that homeopathic medicines are just water, despite the fact that their dilution makes the presence of the active agent impossible. Or you must deny that objects with the same properties have the same effects. Unless you deny one of these plausible ideas, you contradict yourself by believing in the efficacy of homeopathic medicines.

[LesMTS]

This chap, Dr. Jacques Benveniste, is one of the main scientists behind the whole 'water memory' theory that homeopathy could be explained by. Quite interesting, and his results have been replicated.

This is quite the opposite of the truth. Benveniste is a charlatan. Independent teams have consistently failed to reproduce his results and, even more tellingly, he, himself, has been unable to reproduce the results when placed under observation by independent scientists. His experiments only work, it seems, when he and his team are allowed to work alone. The scientific equivalent of a magician telling you to "close your eyes" or "turn around".
Accepting homeopathy would mean re-writing the laws of chemistry and physics and those work just fine, thank you very much.
Homeopathy may have a role for treating minor problems or potentially psychosomatic problems as a placebo but where people are persuaded to reject conventional medicine in favour of homeopathy in order to treat serious illness it becomes sinister. Cancer patients, for example, turning to conventional medicine when it is far too late because they have been wasting their time with these dubious potions. That is why we need studies like this one reported in The Lancet to debunk "alternative medicine" myths and fabrications.